Clarity Media Sudoku Minus (Issue 8)

Great to see another one of these this month Dan. Pleased to say I have managed to complete this one on the first attempt! I think it was a little easier that the last one. It definitely helped that I had kept a list of number combinations from the previous one (all the possible combinations for -3, -2 and -1 ) It saved a bit of working out this time, that and Sue's advice that working out the combinations showed that a 1 or 2 would never appear in a -2 or -3. I would definitely like to see more of these at some point (please!!) Great puzzle

Hi Christine

Great to hear that you enjoyed the puzzle I thought it would be a good idea to supply Gareth with another one after you all went to the effort of writing out a list of the combinations a couple of months back!

It was indeed supposed to be a little easier than the first one, so glad that's how it turned out.

In terms of more of these, when we create a variety sudoku mag, over at our Puzzle Magazine website we'll include this type in the mix

Dan

That's great news Dan - will add that magazine to my list then!!

I agree, thats great to hear Dan. Really loved this puzzle again and (amazingly) finally found the safe place I had put my combo lists.

Let us know when/where we can can find more like this then.

Cheers, Sue

I'll certainly let you know when it's ready!

In the meantime - having checked with Gareth it's OK to post it here as a contributor to his magazine - here's the link to the puzzle magazine site:

http://www.puzzle-magazine.com

Hello Dan - thank you for the link and also to Gareth for allowing it (you two related?). Have just downloaded your Consecutive Mag so will now stop nagging Gareth to put more in Xtra (relieved sigh I hear). Think that should keep me going for a goodly time by which time, no doubt, one or both of you will have come up with a variant to supplant it in my affections.

Minus ones are definitely high on the list so will be delighted if you produce a mag of them. Gareth didn't put one of his excellent -4,-3....3,4 ones on his Killer page this issue which disappointed me (but I might be alone there!).

Thanks again to both for keeping me so amused this summer! Reading is suffering a bit tho...

Hi Sue - Just about to head out the office but wanted to say thanks for purchasing the magazine Rest assured the 'minus mag' is on the to do list so hopefully in the next week or so...

All the best

Dan

I've got the consecutive download too Sue - great fun - have done about a third of them so far. I can also recommend the arrow sudoku if you like a bit of a challenge! Think my puzzling tastes are quite similar to yours as I enjoy having a go at the minus numbers killer too (I don't always complete it but enjoy having a go). In fact sometimes I feel I spend half my puzzling time doing puzzles that never get finished because I can't see much point in doing easy ones (well, I suppose it depends on my mood) and sometimes the difficult ones are beyond me, but I'm pretty good at persevering and like the buzz you get when you crack one!

Funny you should mention the reading Sue - I don't do half as much as I used to! Lucky for me I work in a school and have the six week break coming up shortly - lots more time to spend on all these new puzzles!

Gareth - odd/even pair sudoku is still one of my favourites so please keep that in the magazine! Thanks!

Hello Christine - I agree. I only ever really bother with the harder ones too mostly - unless am tired or am short of time. Like you I don't always finish them but often return to them several weeks later maybe with a fresh print. Never like to be beaten. Also, like you, I really enjoy the odd-pair ones which can be surprisingly tricky until suddenly something sometimes pretty obvious is spotted. I particularly enjoyed the Samurai version that appeared several issues ago. I kept going back to it and when I finally cracked it I was immensely chuffed (but no-one around to share or who cared about my moment of joy!). Gareth, if you are reading, is there any chance you could include another one in a future issue (plus a Samurai Concecutive while you are at it!!!). Perhaps other subscribers don't like the larger puzzles though.

The hardest ones to get started on I find are often the jigsaw inequalities. The normal inequals are quite challenging but usually I can finish them (eventually). In current issue I have managed the 2 top puzzles and have so far spent an hour or so on the bottom left jigsaw version. Am not very proud to say I have only managed to place 3 1's and a 2! Am I alone here?

Am enjoying Dan's consec puzzles tho and will check out the arrow ones over the summer. Thanks for tip... am a teensy bit bit overloaded puzzlewise right now!

hurray - just done it!

Congratulations on that Sue! I know what you mean about sharing the moment! It's a shame there aren't a few more regular posters on the forum because talking about doing similar puzzles does encourage you. I've had a couple of goes at the samurai odd/even from a few issues ago and not managed to crack it yet, but now I know you've done it, well I don't like to be beaten either, so here I go again!! I wouldn't mind another of these either Gareth!

Hello Christine - yes it is a pity so few of us chat on here. Good to find some like minds and encouragement tho.

Good luck with the samurai and do come on here and cheer when you finish it! I confess I slightly "cheated". After several days working on it (not fulltime obv!) I had made some reasonable progress but then it all went wrong and I couldn't find my error (always difficult). Was not prepared to give up tho (but couldn't face starting all over) so I printed off another sheet, transferred all the correct entries and started again from there. In fact I hadn't made too many errors anyway so felt better about my "cheat". If you manage it without any such fiddling I will be very impressed and you become topgirl for a week! I don't know about you but I often find if really stuck that erasing all my "possibles" and starting again from there I often spot something quite obvious which had eluded me. Let me know if you have any other tips (currently stuck on page 26 bottom left!)

Good luck with the BIG one (warning - it took me a week!). Right, football now......Hup Holland Hup!!!

I will make sure all your requests go in the next issue - if nothing else it is just reward for keeping the forum going. As you say, it would be great if more readers got involved! To be fair, however, the traffic dropped when I redesigned the site to make it a link on the right. I think if I made it much more prominent again it might help. I do intend to do a little bit of redesign "soon", so that could help just a little bit perhaps - I think the front page needs some news alongside the cover image, and perhaps I can make it point out latest forum posts too or something.

Dan's arrow puzzles look brilliant - I might ask if he can volunteer one for the next Sudoku Xtra.

Issue 8's Sudoku Minus was the first of this type of puzzle I've attempted. Struggling to get my head around it, so I'm reading up on Sue and Christine's hard work! Thanks for that, ladies!

Great selection at Puzzle-Magazine.com. Have just purchased the Hypersudoku and Arrow Sudoku magazines and will get the Consecutive magazine at some point. I was particularly delighted to see the Arrow Sudoku magazine. I used to do those puzzles in a Japanese magazine which I no longer subscribe to, so I've been missing them!

Good luck with the minus ones Marilyn - they are excellent but you have to put in the groundwork and list every option to progress - well I did anyway. It doesn't take too long to do the lists if you are used to doing Killers and know the combo's for the smaller numbers. Tip: keep list in safe place for next time!!!

Thanks for your comment Gareth - am sure there are more puzzlers out there. I really enjoy swapping thoughts with others. Am off to try some arrow ones now. Thanks all for idea.... just wishing now for some more idle time.........perhaps I'll give up sleep zzzzzzz

Thanks Marilyn

Hope you enjoy them - there are as many arrows as we could fit in in each puzzle, so they can take a while to get going... but I know everyone here likes a challenge!

Dan

Thanks to you all for recommending the Arrow variant. Have downloaded Dan's mag and managed the first few (eventually!). A really interesting variant, I agree....am not very quick tho!

Sue

Glad you like them, Sue. Have to admit, Dan's Arrows are way tougher than others I've done. That's a good thing, though. It means the magazine will take a long time to finish.

I'm still plucking away at Sudoku Minus. I have a love/hate relationship with it at the moment. I love that its frying my brains which makes me determined to finish it (eventually). I hate working out combinations - I went right off Kakuro and Killers for that reason. Still, one has to try a new type of puzzle, and it's such a shame that I keep getting sidetracked from it by so many other puzzles! I have the fancies now for Dan's binary puzzles after sampling a few of them.

Hi Marilyn

Thanks for the post - very interesting to hear that the arrow sudokus are harder than others you've done. I suspect this is because the puzzles contain so many arrows so they do take a lot of effort to build up momentum at the start to break the back of each puzzle! I'm also glad that I decided not to use any 'hard' sudoku rules when making them as perhaps that would have tipped the difficulty over the edge.

In terms of the Sudoku Minus, the good news is once you've made the table of possible combinations the once you can use it to make things much quicker for each additional puzzle you do. There are ten more of them in the new variety sudoku magazine on the puzzle magazine site, added this week! (Also ten of the easier to solve Sudoku Plus and Sudoku Times).

Thanks

Dan

Cheers for that Dan - will download those and hope I can still find my all important "options" sheet.

Will type it and post it on here if anyone is interested - kind of spoils the fun tho. I think these are difficult to do if you haven't done many Kakuro and Killers, Marilyn, and don't have all the positive number combinations fixed in your head. I have always loved those (bit bored of the straightforward ones now tho) but still can't get my head into the loop ones which seem to be your forte. Perhaps we could by the magazines jointly and split them!

*just kidding Gareth/Dan*

That's an idea, Sue!!

Seriously, though, I do lean more towards logic puzzles. The poor old brain just wants to shut down when faced with anything too mathematical. I don't know why that is as I've always liked maths!

I can see the value of a combination list for many different puzzles nowadays. I used to have a list back in the day of Mindgames Magazine, when everyone was raving about Killers. I chucked it, though, which was a really clever thing to do! So I've been making a new list which has even come in handy with the Arrow puzzles - that and a bit of Futoshiki type reasoning.

I am determined to get a Minus and Times done one day!

Hi Sue and Marilyn (and Gareth and Dan for that matter!)

I've been following your conversation with interest and just thought I'd put in my two pennorth! I've downloaded from Dan's site the Arrow, Consecutive, and the Variety magazines and fantastic value for money they are too! I've done about 50 of the consecutive puzzles so far and find them a bit easier than the ones Gareth puts in Xtra. I haven't done many Arrow ones before, but these are definitely harder than the ones I've come across as well (but you're right Dan, we like a challenge! I think I've completed about 10 out of the first 20 so far). As for the variety book I have barely started it yet, but it looks great. I did turn to one of the Sudoku Minus ones last night, but didn't get very far with it (you have to be in the right frame of mind for them I think!). I could be very tempted to ask you to post your "options sheet" Sue, but somehow that feels like cheating! Isn't it strange that sometimes when you look at a puzzle you can hardly get started, but another day it just seems to come much easier? (or sometimes not).

Keep chipping away at that Minus puzzle Sue, and let us know when you get there!

Morning puzzlers... I too downloaded Dan's variety pack. Agree amazing value and excellent puzzles. Am off to Scotland shortly for 3 weeks of walking so beginning to hope we get a lot of rain so I can make some impact on my backlog! Gareth's Issue 9 will no doubt be arriving shortly too. Oh 'eck.

On the subject of the Minus ones, in partic Dan's version which uses 1-9, a tip for Marilyn is to know that no negative total has a "1" in it, and "2" does not appear in -2,-3,-4,-5 either. i made little progress until I discovered this curious fact and it helps a bit. Still very tricky tho and require time and deep thought I find (not always simultaneously available!).

Have a good puzzling day, Sue

Good spot on the Sudoku Minus, Sue

As you say, any negative total in those puzzles cannot contain a 1. This is because each region is always composed of three cells, and you subtract the two smallest values from the largest value.

So, whatever the highest value happens to be, the next highest value is that number - 1. Now if that were combined with a 1 for the final digit in the region, then the lowest possible total for the region is 0, since n - (n-1) - 1 is 0. For instance if the minus region contains a 9,8,1 then we have 9 - 8 - 1 = 0 as the lowest possible total. And so on.

Cheers,

Dan

Thanks for the extra tips!

Enjoy Scotland Sue. Be well-armed with puzzles as you'll be swatting midges regularly!

Have you ever wanted to kick yourself? For some strange reason (impatience I presume) I followed the rules precisely for the Minus puzzles that have appeared in Sudoku Xtra, but upon starting your variety mag Dan, totally forgot that the lower numbers have to be subtracted from the higher one!! No wonder I was making heavy weather of composing my "options sheet" when I had combinations on there such as -4 could be made by 6 - 7 - 3, 6 - 8 - 2 etc etc!! The possibilities were beginning to seem endless! I am only admitting to this so that no-one else makes the same mistake!!!

I have now made myself a comprehensive list for all the negative numbers and was delighted to find that there is only one possible combination for -6 and only two for -5, and as most of the Minus puzzles in the variety mag contain a -5 or -6, and so have limited possible numbers for their cells, then this should make them easier to get started on than the puzzles that only contain -1, -2, -3 where there are a greater possibility of numbers for each cell.

Probably totally obvious to the mathematicians amongst you, but things take a bit longer to soak into the sponge that is my brain!!!

Anyway, I'm rambling again, speaking of which I hope you have a lovely holiday Sue and come back refreshed and raring to go at these puzzles!

Hello Everyone - thanks for all nice comments. Not off for 10 day yet so hoping to take the highlights of Issue 9 with me too. Hopefully midges won't be too bad this year but am armed and dangerous. Glad neg numbers tips helped. They don't work for Gareths version tho as his go from -4 upto +4 and diff combinations are required. Oh dear more maths! Hope there is one in next issue Gareth!!!?

Sue

If you're talking about Sudoku Minus, then only Dan at Clarity makes those so far as I know - there've been two in Sudoku Xtra, and the most recent one in issue 8 had a +6 and +5 in. I asked him to make one with a +6 in so there would be at least one "obvious" clue! (9-1-2, of course).

Issue 9 has a Sudoku Times from Dan in, and with 8 separate community section contributors it's really shaping up to be quite a mag! The cover is a ridiculously large PivotPix (Tentai Show) puzzle. I haven't got it finished yet and I'm off on holiday tomorrow but will be finding an internet cafe on Saturday (I hope!) to get issue 9 online before August starts! I've just been manically printing and checking the puzzles I need to test solve again before I am away from my printer. The different cover sleeves are uploading to Lulu and Createspace as I write.

I'm also just completing Sudoku Pro 54 today and I sent off the 354 proof pages of my latest book earlier today. It's one of those times when all the deadlines come together.

Issue 9 sounds great as ever, and it also sounds as though you will be ready for that holiday Gareth!! Hope you have a great time and manage a few days away from the conputer at least!

Hi Gareth - sorry I meant your neg no's Killer version which were in earlier Xtra's which I for one LOVED. Sorry for confusion.

Looking fwd to issue 9 but don't beat yourself up about deadlines as I, for one, have more than enough to keep me happily puzzling until Christmas probably. 2011.

Have a great holiday, Sue